How to Help Siblings During a Meltdown {EP 189}

Robyn: We're in the middle of a series of talking about your children's siblings. So we spend so much time, of course, talking about your children with big, baffling behaviors, with vulnerable nervous systems, what we can do to make sense of their baffling behaviors, and how we can grow their Owl brains and how we can comb their Watchdog and their Possum brains, and if you are new to the Baffling Behavior Show, and you are new to the concepts of owls and watchdogs and possums, you might want to scroll back to Episode 84 when this episode is over. 84 is a good introduction episode to how we can focus on the nervous system to change behaviors. And I introduce Owls and Watchdogs and Possums in that in that episode, you could also go to RobynGobbel.com/starthere and there you will find a separate podcast feed that I've specially curated just for folks who are at the beginning of this journey. So really what was happening was I was getting the question like, where do I start? There's so much information. And so I took 10 episodes from The Baffling Behavior Show, I put them in the order that I recommend people listen to them in, and I put them in that order inside its own separate podcast feed.    

Robyn: So the episodes in the Start Here podcasts are from the baffling behavior show. You can find them all here as well. But if you'd like to take all the thinking out of it, and you just like a curated list of episodes that will scaffold you in order and give you a great introduction to the nervous system, and parenting kids with big, baffling behaviors. You can go to RobynGobbel.com/starthere for that. We're going to talk about Owls, Watchdogs, Possums a bit in today's episode. I guess we'd probably talk about them in almost all episodes. So yeah, if you find yourself being like, what are you talking about? And you're confused, go to Episode 84, Focus On The Nervous System To Change Behavior. Go to the Start Here podcast. Or, of course, grab Raising Kids With Big Baffling Behaviors, which is the place you are going to get the deepest dive into Owls, Watchdogs, and Possums. If you listen to this podcast regularly, big baffling behaviors, big meltdowns, big moments of dysregulation, intense Watchdog and intense Possum brain moments too, although we don't tend to see intense Possum brain moments as meltdowns, per se, but I would call them meltdowns, big meltdowns, big Watchdog brain behaviors. They're no longer surprising in your home, right? There's predictability in the unpredictability of big Watchdog moments, right? Like you know your child is going to fall down the Watchdog pathway again sometime in the future, maybe even the near future. So even if we can't predict an episode of dysregulation, even if we can't predict the next time the back off or the attack Watchdog is going to jump out, or the next time the shutdown Possum. This is going to take over and be protective. We can't predict that it is going to happen again. We don't know when, but it is going to happen again   

Robyn: So when you have other children in the home, and other siblings who are trying to navigate having a sibling with a big with those big, baffling behaviors, with that vulnerability in their nervous system and last episode, well, in the last several episodes, we've been talking about, really just being honest about the fact that there's a child in your home with a nervous system disability, a child in your home with a special need, and that special needs is expressed with behavior based symptoms, right? The most important thing you can do for the other kids in your home and really, probably for yourself as well as you think about what am I gonna do with my other kids during a meltdown, the most important thing to do is to make a plan, and to make a plan when you're in your Owl brain. Now, I don't know about you all, but I've made plenty of plans from my Watchdog brain, and they sound like I will never, or that will never, or the next time that happens, you got- right? And they're these big, outrageous things, right?    

Robyn: I guess you could call that a plan, but it's gonna be a much more effective plan if you wait until you are back in your own Owl brain. I highly recommend making a plan for what to do, and a sibling is having a big Watchdog or big Possum moment, I highly recommend making that plan with the other kids in your house with them. But- well, if they're the right age, right? If they're two years old, maybe not. But you know, if your kids are of an appropriate age, make this plan together with them, but you're maybe going to want to start the process of making a plan yourself or with your parenting partner, and kind of start percolating on some ideas before inviting your child into the conversation. Maybe, maybe not again. I think that's really going to depend on the age of the other kids in your home and your family.    

Robyn: Okay, so what kinds of things go into this plan? The number one thing, when you're having a child with a big episode of dysregulation, right? We're moving into a bit back off, or attack Watchdog, or shut down or further Possum. The number one priority is, of course, safety. We're gonna start with physical safety and then move into emotional safety. Okay, so when you think about making a plan and making a plan that includes your other kids, think about, where can your kids go. Where do you want them to go? When you have a child who needs all of your attention, who's really dysregulated, who's melting down, having an overactive Watchdog brain, where do you want your other kids to go? How do they get there, and how do they keep them safe, themselves safe once they're there?    

Robyn: Now the specifics of this, they're gonna, you know, vary tremendously based on the age of the other children in your home, how your home is set up, right? There's a lot of variabilities here. What you know your dysregulated child typically does during a meltdown. Some of you have kids who are runners, and they flee and they take off, but maybe they go to a pretty specific place every time. Some of you have kids who get really aggressive or violent. Some of you have kids who, although feel quite unpredictable, there is some predictability in the way that their dysregulation appears. And so, of course, that's got to get taken into account when thinking about where can the other kids in your home, where can they go? How do they keep themselves safe there? Do they just close the door? Do they lock the door? You know, what are their options for safety? Is there someone they can call? And how do they call that person once they're in their safe place. Do you want them to call the neighbor? Do you want them to call a close friend? Do you want them to call your partner if your partner's at home? Do you want them to call their other parent who maybe resides in another home? Do you want them to call your partner who actually is home, but maybe in another part of the house and isn't aware of what's happening.    

Robyn: I have known families with a wide variety of safety plans. I've known families who were so blessed to be resourced with a caring neighbor who could be supportive, or another parent who understood dysregulation, who maybe lived close enough that they could come by or have a family member who could be supportive. If you have a safe person that can be supportive and can actually physically support you, or at the least, you know, connect with your other children and offer some co-regulation and some felt safety to them during these moments. You know, make that kind of a plan. Okay? So where can they go? Who should they call? What should they do when they get there, get to wherever this designated spot is, and and they're safe, and they've called, who they need to call? I get that some of you listening, maybe don't have anybody that your child could call. Maybe some of you listening have kids who could escalate to the point of needing to call 911 and as devastating as that is, you're going to want to have a conversation with other kids in your home about, what are the signs like, what are the reasons we're calling 911, would be necessary, or something that they should do.    

Robyn: Okay? So physical safety first, then after physical safety is established. Now, what should your other kids do? Right? Do they stay in this space where you've, you know, designated? Do they stay there until when? Until the dysregulation is totally over, until, maybe the dysregulation isn't totally over, but it's there. It's safer. You know, when do they stay? How long? How will they know that they can kind of re-engage or reconnect with you and and what can they do in the meantime? Right? Are there special activities you could, like, curate in a bin or and like a special container that it's only available during meltdowns, right? If you have something that they can do that requires headphones, that might be great, right? If it feels safe for your kid to put on headphones and not be aware, like auditorily, of what's happening in the house. Yeah, set them up with something that has headphones. You might need to have, like, an extra set of headphones, or maybe an extra, you know, affordable, cheap device, an old phone or something, right, that can have music on air, can have a favorite audiobook on it, or can have a video or a movie pre-loaded on it, right?    

Robyn: It doesn't have up to date technology. Here you can, like, dig into your, you know, donate pile to see, like, what some out of date technology, maybe that you have that you could kind of put in this place, that your child could use right to feel safe, to feel distracted, right? So think about those kinds of things. And I do think it can be helpful if those are kind of special things, like, they're only things that come out or accessible or available during these times. It doesn't have to be like an activity that is only allowed during that time. It doesn't have to be that special. But like, if it's, you know, coloring book and crayons that there is a special coloring book for, you know, that time where there's, you know, certain craft items that are there, right? So they're not, like, completely unique activities, but the maybe the materials, or what's going along with that activity is unique and in there. Some of you have kids who when they're really dysregulated, you are primarily passively co-regulating them. So maybe you're sitting outside their door, or you're sitting there by to kind of ensure their safety, but you are not actively intervening or actively co-regulating them. Now, I know that's not true for all of you, but if that's true for you, and you know that you often spend some time in that state of passive co-regulation, think about how your kid's siblings could reach you during this time, right? Can they have, or do they have a device where they could text you, right? Is there maybe a special device that's in the room where they've gone so that they can call their neighbor and then they can be in touch with you? Can they wear a smartwatch so that they could text you and maybe another safe person, and they could get a text back from you.   

Robyn: If there is a way to be able to stay in contact with that sibling, especially if they are somewhere without a safe adult, that can be really helpful. It can help them feel safer. They feel safer being connected to you, but they also feel safe. For knowing that you're okay. So think about that, with all the technology that's available today, is there a way you can stay in contact with siblings while you're tending to the dysregulated child? Make sure you're giving yourself permission to abandon things like screen time rules. In these moments, your goal is, how do I help this child feel safe, less scared, and, yeah, distracted, especially if it might go on for a while. And so it is okay give yourself total permission, to abandon all of kind of the typical parameters you have around those kinds of things, as long as it can be done safely.    

Robyn: Think it's really important that when you make this plan, you have a age appropriate conversation with your other kids and kind of challenge yourself on what you think age appropriate means. It's been my experience when I was working as a therapist that kids can understand things and have complicated conversations much younger than we typically think they are. They can, and this is especially true for kids who live in dysregulated families, right? Like these hard things are already happening. They know that they're happening, so let's just talk about it and give words to it, right? So you can help your kid have a story or a narrative that sounds kind of like, you know, my job is to keep everyone safe. I'm keeping your siblings safe by whatever you're doing, by bringing them to a safe place in the house, by bringing them to a room where there's things that can't hurt them, by bringing them, you know, a snack. Because I know that when they're really Watchdog brain, they almost always get better when they almost always feel safer when they have a snack, right? So I'm keeping your siblings safe by the things that's true you're gonna do. I'm keeping you safe by having this special place in the house for you, getting these headphones, making sure you have a device so that you can text me and text grandma or the next-door neighbor if you need to whatever, whatever, whatever, whatever it is that your plan is, and then following that up with, I wish this were different.    

Robyn: I wish these weren't the kinds of plans we needed to make in our family, but they are the kinds of plans we need to make in a family. And this is how it is for families of kids who have overactive Watchdog brains, and then you may, you know, find an opportunity to talk a little bit more about overactive Watchdog brains, or those kinds of things that we've talked about in previous episodes, and really validate them like we talked about last episode. Tell them that you know, this is scary and unfair. Tell them that you know that they deserve to be tended to, supported, co-regulated, kept safe, that they deserve that. Tell them that when the dysregulation of their sibling is happening, it might seem like you've forgotten all about them, but you haven't. But the truth is that you have to pay attention to the person who is the most scared or who has the most dangerous Watchdog or Possum brain, so that you can keep everyone safe, maybe, maybe even have a code word or an action that you could say or do when you're tending to the child with big, baffling behaviors, the child who's really dysregulated. That helps your other children know that helps their siblings. Know I see you too. I haven't forgotten about you, even though I have to tend to your sibling right now. I haven't forgotten about you. You're still there. I see you right? And a code word to that could capture that sentiment could be really helpful.    

Robyn: Y'all, I just got that idea from mom in the club, and I just thought it was so brilliant as somebody maybe who just really resonates with, you know, craving feeling not forgotten about or craving feeling seen. And I know that when you're attending to your very dysregulated kids, your other kids are gonna feel forgotten, they're gonna feel unseen, they're gonna feel like they're not even there, and you're not gonna be able to tell them, I haven't forgotten about you. I see you. I know this is really hard for you. I have to attend to your dysregulated sibling. I mean, you're probably not gonna be able to say that, because you have a very have a very dysregulated child to tend to, and also that might just regulate the more if you say that, right? But a little code word or a code gesture that lets them know, Hey, I see you. I haven't forgotten about you. I know this is hard. Oh man, I just think that could be so powerful.    

Robyn: Now, when your child is, you know, less dysregulated, not like full on attack, right? They're not dangerous. They're dysregulated, but not dangerous. I do think it's okay to teach the other children in your house how to not provoke or increase dysregulation. Now this can be really tricky, because we do not want to unintentionally insinuate to the other kids in our house that it's their fault, or that it's their responsibility right to take care of their siblings feelings, or that they have to sacrifice their real feelings and prioritize their siblings refilling real feelings. Okay, so that this is a real tricky nuance, but y'all the reality is that is that when someone is very vulnerable, the rest of us do have to make accommodations. And also the reality is, the truth is, is that like the world would work better if we all did that, like if those of us with more resilience in our nervous system, with more privilege, with more capacity, with more access to resources, whatever you want to say, We're willing to make some sacrifices because of the folks who are more vulnerable, if we are the ones who are willing to make changes before the folks who are more vulnerable that would have such an unbelievably profound impact on like everything in the world, I just can hardly even imagine that.    

Robyn: And so while we don't want to teach our kids to sacrifice themselves for other people, or to not care about how they're feeling and only care about other people, or to teach them to act a different way so that other people don't get mad, right? Like, we don't want to teach these kids these essentially like kind of codependent behaviors. I do think we can help them to see that when someone else is very vulnerable and you have more capacity, it's okay to make a choice, to do something different that helps a person who is a little little more vulnerable. We can set our own needs aside, we can make some accommodations. Also teach your kids some of their siblings Watchdog and Possum cues and clues, some of the cues and clues that your more vulnerable child demonstrates that really means something like stop bothering me, right? Teach your other kids what some of those cues and clues are like, the cues and clues of I'm about to freak out. Teach your kids what those cues and clues are and teach them to interpret them as it's time to get help. It's time to leave my sibling alone and go get the grown up. Okay, that's what those cues and clues mean as far as your other kids are concerned.    

Robyn: And maybe for some of you, unfortunately, some of those cues and clues in your more vulnerable child what they mean to your other kids, to their siblings, might even be something like stop interacting with with this child and just give them what they want, to decrease the escalation in this moment and then come get me. The most important thing to do when we are kind of changing our own behavior because of somebody else's dysregulation. Most important thing to do is to do it from an Owl brain perspective. Where this gets tricky is when we start kind of making these implicit of these unconscious ways that we're shifting ourselves or shifting our behavior in order to kind of keep everyone else happy or decrease it, you know, intensity or dysregulation around us, if we can be conscious of it and make a choice, right? And so the choice might be, uh oh, my brother's about to go total attack Watchdog. It's completely not fair, that he's using his Watchdog brain to be able to get to watch whatever TV show he wants to watch. But sometimes attack Watchdogs do things that are mean and not fair, and so I'm going to let him watch this TV show that he wants, and I'm going to go get mom, dad, grandma, whoever you are, to this child. I'm going to go get them for help.   

Robyn: It'll be important that you listen to last week's episode about validation and grief, because there are so many feelings here to validate. I mean, it is just simply not fair. It is not fair for me, the child who acts good to have to like not do what I want or get what I want for the child who acts bad. But that also brings us back to three weeks ago's episode, where it is so important to untangle the beliefs in our family about what it means to act good and act bad and be good and be bad, that acting bad is a cute or a clue of vulnerability in the nervous system, it's not about getting what we want. It's about helping and accommodating folks who are the most vulnerable, right? So of course, we start with validation. You're right. It's not fair. It does feel like the person with the worst behavior is always getting what they want, and then there could eventually be opportunities, and it might not even need to be said, but there could eventually be opportunities to talk about folks that have vulnerable nervous systems do need the rest of us to make accommodations. And you're right. It's not fair. The person with the most vulnerability gets the most accommodations. It's not giving them what they want. Y'all, vulnerable people don't want to be vulnerable. This is not what they want. It is very, very hard, and even as your siblings start to understand this, they are still going to have a lot of feelings about this, right? They're not gonna just say, Oh, no problem, my sibling, has a lot of needs, and this is just how it goes. No, they're still gonna be mad or upset or have grief or feel resentful, right?    

Robyn: And so if you are struggling to kind of recognize and validate some of those kids, you know, very real, righteous feelings, and what I want you to do is head back to last week's episode about grief. And in that episode, we also talked about just validating all of their feelings, not just grief. Now there are some assumptions in this episode that the sibling we're talking about is not needing to be actively co-regulated to meaning they're not as equally dysregulated as the other child, right? We're making some assumptions in this episode that the siblings we're talking about have enough Owl brain in that moment to follow a plan and find some safety. If you're finding yourself more often in that dysregulation is super contagious category, and like everyone in your home is getting dysregulated and going total Watchdog or Possum and flipping their lids, and you just don't know what to do. Come back for next week's episode. Now I'm gonna give you the disclaimer, don't come back hoping that I'm gonna give you some magical solution to that. Y'all know there's no magic solution to having a lot of dysregulated kids all at once. There's just not, you're not doing it wrong. There's not something I can tell you where you would suddenly be able to navigate that better. It is hard to be with lots of dysregulated people. But simply because there is no magic answer, doesn't mean we're not going to talk about it. Because it's still really important that we talk about this and validate your experience and give you some ideas about what you might be able to do in those moments where everyone, maybe even including you, is totally melting down.    

So today's- In summary, let me summarize today for you. We talked about what you can do when you have a sibling who has enough owl brain to find safety. What they can do right during a meltdown, during a moment of dysregulation, make a plan that plan needs to include, you know, a way that they can be safe physically, a way that they can be safe emotionally, which might mean there's somebody they can contact, or they can stay in contact with you. They have an activity to do, they can be distracted. Maybe they can even have headphones, right? And that they have a story for this, right? That they have an understanding for why you're making the choices you're making, why you're attending to their siblings ahead of them. It doesn't mean that they're unseen. You know that they also need help and support, but that your job is to first keep everybody physically safe. I am hoping so much that this sibling series is feeling helpful for you. If you are in the club, remember that we did a sibling master class in July. I mean, if you're listening to this way in the future and you're in the club, you can just go to the video library and you can find the recording for that masterclass we did in July of 2024 and throughout the month of July, we're going to Have a lot of discussion inside the forum. We're going to be talking about these podcasts so that we can take the ideas of these podcasts and get even more practical and apply them even more to your family's life. So if you're in the club, don't let that resource go to waste. Come into the forum. You don't have to post. You can just you can just read, right? Those of you not in the club, I hope you are still really enjoying this series. Hope you're getting something out of this series on siblings.    

I have at least two more episodes planned about siblings next week, which will be, you know, when you have multiple regulated kids at once, and then the week after that, we'll talk about helping your kids who are really verbally attacked and bullied, even by your child with a vulnerable nervous system, how we can help your kids with that, because you can't stop what's coming out of your other kids' mouths, right? We talked about that a lot back in the strengthening psychological boundaries episode. If you haven't been to my website lately, go check out my website, RobynGobbel.com especially go to RobynGobbel.com/freeresources. Pretty continuously adding new free resources. So it's been a month or so since you've been there, go check it out. There might be something new there. Also, over on my website, on the podcast page, there's a search bar, so you can enter a search term, and if you're hoping I have a podcast about a certain topic, you can put that in the search bar and it will tell you, it will bring up episodes that might be related to the topic you're looking for. So that's RobynGobbel.com/podcast, Oh, y'all. It's so great to be with you again today. Thank you, as always, thank you. Thank you for everything you're doing for kids with vulnerable nervous systems, for yourself, for all of your other kids, for everyone in this world, because I believe, I believe that this work matters. All right, I'll see you next week. Bye!