Sarah Bren, PhD is a clinical psychologist and mom to two little ones in upstate New York where she loves to work with new parents, especially parents who want to parent differently than they were parented.  

Dr. Bren developed an interest in working with parents when she became a parent herself.  She was learning about parenting and parenting models and realized that so much of what she was reading directly related to the work she was doing with adult clients.

This insight sparked Dr. Bren’s interest in working with parents with the goal of helping parents break generational patterns and hopefully reduce the number of adults who have to heal from their childhoods.

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There is no checklist- or is there?

I remember when I first learned about attachment parenting, I really wanted a better checklist.  I wanted the parenting experts to just tell me what to do to raise a kid with secure attachment.  

Regretfully, I didn’t find exactly the checklist I was looking for. Yet Dr. Bren reminded me that in a way, there is a checklist.  It just doesn’t contain things like “babywear” or “cosleep.”

The Secure Attachment Checklist

  • Can I sit in this space and just be with my child?
  • Can I respond to their needs?
  • Can I respond to my needs?
  • Can we both be two humans in this space, paying attention, tuned to it, but still two separate human beings?

Attachment Theory

Dr. Bren looks at attachment theory as an umbrella.  Under the umbrella there are lots of different ways of parenting that are supported by attachment theory.  For some families, that’s attachment parenting.  For some families, it’s not.

Dr. Bren reminds us that secure attachment emerges from secure attachment to ourselves.  Secure attachment to ourselves involves being attuned to ourselves, noticing our own needs and feelings, and responding to our own needs while negotiating how to respond to our child’s needs.  

Disconnecting from Ourselves

When we lose ourselves in the parenting relationship and focus only on our children’s needs and never on our own, we can unintentionally foster a relationship that looks more like co-dependence.  

Our children can struggle to feel like separate individuals. This ultimately leads to a lot of anxiety when children and parents aren’t together.  

Secure Attachment

Secure attachment leads to feelings of both connection and autonomy.  Togetherness and separateness.  

When babies are born, they are merged with their caregiver.  This is by design!  

As babies grow and get older, it’s inevitable that their caregiver will misattune to them.  

Not only is this inevitable but it’s good.  It allows our children to develop their sense of separateness.  

“I’m different from my caregiver.  We aren’t the same person. I am me and you are you.” ~Babies developing secure attachment. 

This separateness is actually the very foundation for secure attachment.  

Attunement to Self First

It’s impossible to attune to someone else if you aren’t first attuned to ourselves.  

As a parent, this can be so hard!  We are working so hard to be tuned in to our kids that we can lose our attunement to ourselves.  

Attachment and Older Kids (including adult children)

You might be reading this and reflecting on attachment with your older child- maybe even with your adult children.

Sometimes learning about attachment when our children are older can evoke a feeling of hopelessness. It can feel like it’s too late to make any changes.

It’s never too late and there is so much hope!

Attachment and Relationships can Always Change.  

When we are motivated to shift our relationship with our older or adult children, we often want to know what to do.

The first step, though, is getting quiet with ourselves. The first step is determining where your own safety is.  How do you feel safe?  What is the safest relationship you have ever had?  

If we want our children to feel safe in their relationship with us, we have to feel safe in our relationship with ourselves.  

The second step is often to explore our own attachment relationships.  How were we parented? And how did that impact us? Why are my triggers?

The third step, and only after we explore steps one and two, is to ask ourselves the question “And now what do I do differently?”

Curiosity Leads to Secure Attachment

Exploring these types of questions with ourselves is a step toward more security with ourselves!  Curiosity both leads to and emerges from secure attachment.  

If we had caregivers who were with us with curiosity, that curiosity becomes our narrative.  If we had caregivers who were harsh or critical, that criticism becomes our narrative.

As an adult working toward secure attachment, we can develop relationships with curious people and can become our own curious voice.

Instead of asking ourselves “What is wrong with you?” we can shift to asking ourselves “That’s interesting- I wonder what’s happening right now?”

Internalizing a New Voice

It’s possible to internalize the curious voice of a friend, a partner, or a therapist.  It’s also possible to internalize the curious voice of a fictional character.

One of my internalized fictional characters is Anne from Anne of Green Gables.  Her curiosity for life, her delight, her ease in finding the goodness in everyone is a way of being I’ve deliberately internalized.  

Dr. Bren and I agree that we both think therapy is a wonderful way to develop a new way of being with ourselves, but it’s not the only way.  So many people don’t have access to therapy, and so many people have found healing without therapy.  

How Do I Do Differently For My Kids?

So many of us want to parent our kids differently than we were parented.  It’s important to take one step back from that question and ask ourselves “How can we parent ourselves differently?”

  • Can we be with ourselves in a curious, compassionate way?
  • Can we welcome all of our own feelings and even the times where we parent in a way we wish we hadn’t?  

If we can do that with ourselves, we’ll be more successful at doing this with our children.

The curious, compassionate, “all parts of you are welcome” way of being is the path to secure attachment with our children. ~Robyn Gobbel

Find Dr. Sarah Bren

Follow Dr. Bren on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/drsarahbren/

Listen to Dr. Bren’s podcast: https://drsarahbren.com/category/podcast/

Listen to when I was a guest on Dr. Bren’s podcast: https://drsarahbren.com/26-redefining-trauma-informed-parenting-how-parents-can-utilize-this-framework-for-all-children/

Check our Dr. Bren’s parent course: https://drsarahbren.com/tap

Explore More About Attachment

Early in this episode, Dr. Bren and I briefly discussed my free downloadable eBook all about The Brilliance of Attachment. Download that free eBook here: https://robyngobbel.com/ebook

Robyn

Would you like to explore a complete paradigm-shift on how we see behavior? You can watch my F R E E 45(ish) minute-long masterclass on What Behavior Really Is and How to Change It.

Just let me know where to send the links!


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The curious paradox is that when I accept myself just as I am, then I can change. ~Carl Rogers

The Science Backs it Up

You know, one of my favorite things about studying relational neuroscience is discovering the science that proves things we’ve known all along. 

Not everyone needs the science, and I know some think the science destracts from the powerful truths that people have been brave enough to say and believe without having science to back it up.  

I think both approaches are fine.  I just happen to like the science.  

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Acceptance Leads to Change?!

Y’all I remember being pretty pissed about this sentiment by Carl Rogers.  

How could I accept parts of myself?  How could I do that with the explicit purpose of wanting to change because frankly that seemed to contradict itself.  And I wanted to follow the instructions correctly because yeah I really wanted to change.  I’m very good at following instructions to eventually obtain the end result.

But that didn’t seem exactly what Carl Rogers had in mind.  

I also wanted to understand why.  WHY did acceptance lead to the possibility of change?

You know, I needed to make sure Carl Rogers wasn’t tricking me.  And if I could understand the mechanics of this phenomenon I could perhaps risk accepting the parts of me I was pretty desperate to change.  

The Mechanisms of Change

First I had to understand the mechanisms behind change.

Change that wasn’t just about developing a new behavior that was stronger than the one I wanted to change but real true change.  Change that reached the depths of whatever was driving that behavior.

The Path for Integration

The field of interpersonal neurobiology tells us that the characteristics of integration are Flexibility, Adaptability, Coherence, Energetic, and Stable. 

That seemed like a good place for me to start because yeah, the parts of myself I was pretty desperate to change aren’t flexible, adaptive, coherent, energetic or stable.

But here’s something interesting…desperation isn’t flexible, adaptive, coherent, energetic or stable either.  Desperation is the opposite of flexible, that’s for sure.  Desperation, for me, is quite rigid and actually pretty stagnant, not energetic.  

I pondered this- I was seeking integration for sure, but taking a path that wasn’t integrated at all.

I suspected that was something worth looking into.

The idea of integration intrigued me, though it did perplex me a little.  It felt slippery- I couldn’t quite hold on to the definition and wasn’t sure exactly what it meant.  But I was intrigued.

Characteristics of Integration

Interpersonal Neurobiology also tells us that an integrated mind leads to response flexibility, regulation, the ability to participate in attuned communication, empathy, insight.

Cool.  I wanted those things.  

The parts of me I was desperate to change weren’t those things.  

But then I learned something else that really actually changed my whole life.

Always Seeking Connection

We are all always seeking connection, and my mentor Bonnie Badenoch says the most nourishing connections we can imagine.  

That one gave me pause.

How could this make sense?  How could I bring together some of these behaviors I was desperate to change with the idea that my system was always seeking connection?

Because just take my word for it- these weren’t behaviors there were exactly inviting connection.

They weren’t behaviors that were inviting connection with others and definitely not with myself- given that I was desperate to banish them.  

Could both be true? Could there be a part of me that has behaviors that I want to change while another part of me that’s always seeking nourishing connections?

Not All of Me

I suddenly had to consider the possibility that the part of me I wanted to change was indeed- just a part.

It wasn’t all of me.

It wasn’t who I was at my core. 

Who I am at my core is the same as who everyone else is at their core.

Precious. Good. Full of infinite worth. Longing for connection.  Deserving of connection.  

Easier to Believe about Others

I’m telling this story a little bit backwards actually because for me, it was easier to believe these ideas first about everyone else.

I embraced this theory as a professional first.

I embraced this theory as a professional who loved to work with kids who’d experienced attachment trauma.

Who had very real, troubling, and even dangerous behaviors that certainly did not invite connection.

They were kids who seemed as though the last thing they ever would want is connection and they worked quite hard to make sure we all knew that.

I embraced this theory during a time period when the popular belief about kids with a history of attachment trauma was basically the opposite of “we are all longing for connection.”  

I felt like I had to.

I didn’t know how else to keep showing up to work to welcome these kids – and adults too – who had very intense push away behaviors if I didn’t believe that somewhere underneath all of it they were – like everyone else- seeking connection.

Accepting Isn’t Excusing

OK back to the idea that it’s only when we can accept something as it is that change becomes possible.  

There was a part of me that thought accepting meant excusing, allowing, or inviting.

If I accepted this part of me- if I accepted these parts of my clients- it meant I was giving up.

But how could it possibly mean that if I knew in my core that we are all always seeking connection.

What if I could really truly trust that truth?

What if I didn’t need to try to change anyone- including myself- because we are all always trying to move toward integration?

What if acceptance absolutely positively did not mean the behavior that was emerging from that part of self was OK?  

What if acceptance simply means that I am connecting to reality in this moment. 

Acceptance means getting very curious and compassionate about what is happening inside that person- or myself- that is more powerful than our inherent drive for connection.

Survival and Connection

It’s not that our inherent drive for connection- and therefore for behaviors that are inviting of connection- disappears.  It’s that something else becomes more powerful.

We are all driven for connection, yet, but we are all also driven for survival.  

Can you imagine anything more tragic than the felt sense that connection – to ourselves or to others- is so terrifying that protection based behaviors emerge instead?

OK OK OK I’m veering off track again from the premise here- that only when we accept something as it is is change possible.

I mean, I’m kinda veering off track.  I’m really showing you all the tracks I took to finally be willing to believe that.

Integration invites Integration.

If I want something in myself to change- or something in someone else to change- I have to find a way to be with that something with an integrated presence.

What the heck is an integrated presence!?

Well I won’t bore you will alllll the science but we can be certain than an integrated presence has characteristics like curiosity and compassion.  An integrated presence feels open, not constricted, and definitely not desperate.

I’m a therapist so I worked my tail off cultivating the ability to sit with folks – some of who had extremely challenging behaviors not just outside my office but inside my office- with curiosity and compassion.

Notice, I never said CALM.

This is True of All of Us. Including Ourselves.

Eventually I had to have a real heart to heart with myself as I wondered why I continued to consider myself the one outlying variable here.

Why wasn’t I worthy of this approach?

Could I connect with the parts of myself that I was desperate to change with curiosity and compassion??

Turns out, I can.

Connecting with Ourselves

Yup, it’s reallllllly hard work.  It’s so counterintuitive.  It almost feels even absurd at times.

But I can and I must and I do and it’s exactly what the hurting parts of me need.

It’s also exactly what the hurting parts of our kids need.

Behaviors of Hurt and Fear

We have to stay grounded in the truth that these behaviors that we realllllly want to change are indeed grounded in hurt and fear.

They must be.  If there was no hurt and fear, connection based behaviors would emerge.

No Step by Step Instructions

There is no formula I can give you, no step by step instructions on how to practice this place of acceptance while also still honoring your own truth which is that you realllllly want a certain behavior to change.

Maybe, in your quietest moments, you connect with the parts of you that want a behavior to change – in yourself or in others- and you experiment with curiosity.

Why would someone who is biologically driven for connection have a behavior that is pushing away connection?

I promise promise promise that we can find moments of acceptance that aren’t about giving up, or allowing bad behavior, or no longer hoping something changes.

Acceptance is About One Moment

Acceptance is about a moment.  In this moment, my child or me or my partner or my client, has something happening for them that is leading them to believe they need to prioritize behaviors of protection over behaviors of connection.  

Sometimes- certainly not ALL the times but sometimes- that may just inspire us to lean in and offer safety.  Or connection.  

A gesture that makes sense when our belief is “you’re hurting” instead of a belief of “I need your behavior to change.”  

You’re Doing the Very Best you Can.

Always.  Your desperation to get a behavior to change is emerging from your own fear.  Your fear deserves to be met with compassion.

Maybe that’s why you come here.  So I can give you heaps of compassion.

Until one day you’ll notice that you hear my compassionate voice in your head even when you aren’t listening to this podcast.

And then one day you’ll notice that the compassionate voice in your head is yours.

You know what’s super cool?  What I’m doing for you is what you are doing for your child.  They’ll eventually internalize your compassion and eventually they’ll have compassion for themselves.

I can’t think of anything more amazing.

Robyn

Would you like to explore a complete paradigm-shift on how we see behavior? You can watch my F R E E 45(ish) minute-long masterclass on What Behavior Really Is and How to Change It.

Just let me know where to send the links!